AutoblogGreen

I ride, having done so for twenty five plus years, and I would never recommend a motorcycle to anyone to save gas. Never, ever. First they are no fun when it rains. They aren't much fun when it gets below 50 or above 90. They are useless when it snows. Then top it off with the safety issues and well it just doesn't add up.

Ride because you want to, don't ride because you think you have to

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I've had my one brush with death when a car did a leftUturn into my lane; I went flying (blacked out) landed and body-slid across the pavement. Not a broken bone on me. But, some abrasions. Now that I have 5 mouths to feed, I'll delay a bike purchase until maybe never. But, I love riding bikes.

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I used to ride a Ninja 250 like the one pictured in the article, and I routinely got 65 mpg out of that little machine.

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"I would never recommend a motorcycle to anyone to save gas."

I don't see why not. Various people on this site have recommended scooters to save gas, and a motorcycle is just a scooter styled differently. Just because you can't ride every day does not mean you can't save gas on those days you do ride. While my SV650 is kick-in-th-pants fun, I still seem to get about 55 mpg no matter how ...enthusiastically... I drive, but I still tend to drive it pretty conservatively when I'm around other vehicles.

Have you ever seen a sports-bike on the highway (only) going the speed limit? Yeah. That was me.

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Along the lines of what Chris said, I have to point out that it's also NOT cheaper to ride a motorcycle. I too have nearly a decade of experience, spent 8 years on 2-wheels only and didn't want to believe what I just said. Then a friend challenged me to a cost comparison with his Toyota Corolla. I came out several thousands of dollars down on Just the "average cost per mile", not taking into account purchase price (though that was nearly a wash with his 15 year old car and all the protective gear that is a MUST when riding motorcycles plus the motorcycle).

FWIW, I've seen owners of the EX250 (pictured) return better than 70mpg. They are the "hypermilers" of the community doing long stints on the interstate at a time, but anyone riding sanely can get mid 60's without issue. And it IS a great way to make commutes better as there's a lot of joy that's derived from riding a motorcycle. Something that can't be measured in dollars and cents (heh, unless you can drop your therapist because you took up motorcycling. :) )

Brian

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Ditto to what Chris said. Correlation does not mean causation.

Consider the cost of actually operating the motorcycle. A car owner can pay less than $400 to have a set of four tires professionally installed, which (barring a blowout) will last at least 60,000 miles. The rear tire on a motorcycle typically needs replaced each 6k-7k miles (which can run upwards of $300, professionally installed), and the front tire approximately each 10k miles (which can run close to $200, professionally installed). Changing the tires yourself could help trim costs, but I've replaced motorcycle tires and recognize it is a challenge that most owners aren't up to.

When you do the math of cents per mile, the cost of tires alone easily negates the savings in fuel purchases, and that's before the cost of insurance, safety gear, more frequent oil changes and other routine but critical maintanence, and the inconvenience of inclimate weather.

I think the increase in motorcycle registrations over the last decade has more to with aging baby boomers trying to recapture the excitement of their youth, facilitated by high levels of disposable income and/or easy credit... much moreso than concerns over fuel prices at the pump within the last five years.

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Keep in mind average occupancy per vehicle. If that "average car" has four occupants, it has a fuel efficiency of almost 90MPG/person. While that is generally not the case, it's worth mentioning. Two in the car gets you up to 45mpg/passenger.

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I average about 57mpg on my bike, mainly cause of the smaller motor. For sport bike riders though, anyone with a race tuned newer bike will be getting maybe 40mpg or lower. If trying to save on gas, make sure you get a bike truly made to do so.

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@chris: your comments are really, really contingent on location. are you addressing someone who lives and commutes in the city or in the country? are you addressing someone who lives in a rainy east cost or NW climate, someone in the deep south, or someone in CA? each factor significantly affects the viability of two-wheeled commuting. i live in a rainy city and i'd say i rode my bicycle or motorcycle to work about 1/2 of the time back when i was commuting, and i wasn't trying to save the world, i just rode when i felt like it.

@BrianM: you didn't mention what bike you factored into your comparison. even if you include purchasing full gear, i have a hard time believing that a ninja 250 would end up costing more than a car no matter what the timeframe.

@00solstice: 3.5x10 scooter tires are about $30 each and can be changed yourself. depending on the motorcycle, you can easily find tires in the $75-100 range. if your tires cost $300, you're not exactly riding the most practical commuting machine.

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I ride a motorcycle and I love it. I will say that it saves me a bit on gas, but thats really not why I ride it.

Especially because I don't live in a place where it is sunny and warm constantly, I have to own a car in addition to my motorcycle. Just taking into account the fact that I now have to insure an extra vehicle at $50/month, I am NOT saving money by driving a motorcycle. And that doesn't even include maintenance costs or the purchase price of the bike.

However, by riding it on nice days instead of driving my car, I AM saving gas and making some of that $50/month insurance money pay for itself.

Of course, just having the bike around makes me more likely to ride it b/c I am more likely to travel more often than if I had to drive a car (I hate driving cages around!), so I think I'm not really saving any gas at all.

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I know this is being picky but Jeremy mentioned

"we're pretty sure that the owners of said two-wheelers are enjoying the less frequent fill-ups that their rides require"

The actual fact of the matter motorcycles need more frequent fill-ups becuase they generally only hold 2-4 gallons of gasoline, and therefore do not have the range of a car.

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I've been riding my motorcycle for the gas savings. I change tires every 10k and it DOESN'T cost $300. Maybe $120. Just like a car, only 4 time less. I do fill up my motorcycle more often because my tank is only 3 gallons, but my car get 22-24 mpg, where my motorcycle gets 40+ mpg. I enjoy the motorcycle way more than my car. I don't ride during predicted rainy days and really cold days. I wish I could find a covered motorcycle, but haven't yet. I would probably ride more if I could. Anyone know of any? As far as recommending riding a motorcycle in order to save gas...heck yes! They're cheap to buy and run.

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Hi Jon and Richard,

As I wrote, it's nearly $300 for a rear mid-range quality Dunlop 130/90-16 to be professionally installed. That's not just price of the tire, but also the shop labor rate of disconnecting the final drive, removing the wheel, removing the tire, mounting the tire, balancing the tire, re-installing the wheel, and reconnecting the drivetrain. It costs less for the front because the tire costs less (less rubber), and there's no extra time/labor associated with the drivetrain when working with the front wheel.

The cost of the tire is not determined by the efficiency of the bike, but the rather the application. I should know, my stable includes

1996 XL1200C
1985 ZX900
2008 DRZ400SM
1973 DT250
1971 T350 (RIP)
1978 KZ650 (project)
1997 XV750 (sold)
1988 XV535 (sold)

The cruel irony is that professional mechanics tend to want to install tires they sell, usually priced at Fatbook/PartsUnlimited MSRP. You can find the same tires up to 40% cheaper by ordering online, but many shops won't install tires bought elsewhere or (if you're lucky) will want the wheel off the bike, citing "liability concerns" of installing a tire bought elsewhere. I call b.s., and would rather they be upfront and refer to it as "maximum profitability concerns" instead.

Despite the experience my friends and I have accumulated working on cars and motorcycles, we've been somewhat unsuccessful replacing tires on a KZ440 and CB550 (punctured inner tubes, uncertain balancing). Given the speeds we ride these motorcycles (as opposed to scooters), we're fairly insistent the tires are mounted and balanced correctly. So, as such, we're pretty much at the mercy of the local shops' prices and policies... as are most of the motorcycle riding public who don't have hours to toil, sweat, and bleed in their garages every 7k miles.

If you have any resources you'd like to share as to how to make DIY tire mounting/balancing easier, safe, and certain, I'm all ears.

Cheers,
Steve

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Steve, you're on base as far as I'm concerned. My background (besides owning a few dozen bikes) includes being a factory trained and certified wrench for Yamaha, Suzuki and Harley Davidson.

Yes, for an EX250, you CAN buy touring tires for $170 before shipping that will last better than 10k miles. But unless you're doing the mounting and balancing yourself, you're stuck with what Steve said. Shops that just plain won't mount mail-order tires (common). But that aside, if we're talking the most fuel efficient motorcycle commonly available, and that is the EX250 to the best of my knowledge, then you're looking at mandatory valve lash adjustments every 5~6k miles. For enthusiasts, it's a few hours of time on a weekend. Do you want to spend that time doing maintenance? If not, expect a recurring $300 cost for that service. Final drive will last about 20k is cared for (longer with motorcycles that have larger chains, belt or nearly never for shaft drive bikes). Brakes... well, some go through them quickly while others nearly never need them (depends on driving style). Oil changes are going to need to be done every 6k miles with top quality synthetics vs. the 20k+ that can be safely done in cars.

For my experiment with a friend, I was riding a Honda VF500f. It saw in the mid 50's for MPG, used cheap tires and I did all the maintenance myself. This was for commuting in/around the Washington DC area (80miles per day commute for me, about 60 for my friend). We broke costs down to cents per mile and multiplied by a fixed number of miles. If I remember correctly, the bike was just into the $0.10~0.11 mile range while the car was down around $0.08 ~ over 15,000 miles that's a cost of $300 per year to ride the bike, over several years and you're into the thousands. Again, NOT including purchase prices... and with labor removed. Labor on motorcycles is not only more expensive, but it's more frequent.

The final observation is that while motorcycles CAN go well over 100,000 miles ~ it's very rare to see one that has. This is because of the 2-wheel factor not being a very steady one when left to it's own devices. So bad roads, inattentive drivers, etc... can cause several thousand more dollars to a bike where as on an econo-box, you'd like just wrinkle your nose at the blemish and go about your life without fixing it. Insurance is also significantly more, Especially if you're relying on the bike for transportation... it means either doing your own work, or carrying comprehensive and collision. I can get just liability lower on some motorcycles than a car, but that just closes the gap slightly.

If you Truly believe motorcycles are cheaper, then keep Detailed information and compare it against my real world cost per mile of $.061 for my Jetta TDI. This includes ALL costs but that of the car over 83,000 miles (car has 164,000 on it currently). Insurance, tags, title changes, fuel, oil, maintenance items, etc.... There is no labor included as I do my own.

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I have the earlier carb'ed 2000 SV650, and I get 47-49 mpg on it. I'm NOT the guy seen doing the speed limit. I'm the guy seen jetting from stop lights at full throttle, and I've still never gotten less than 47 mpg. Obviously I didn't buy my bike for fuel efficiency reasons. But when I look in my garage for something to take to work in the morning, I do take the great MPG I get from my bike into account.

I'm under no illusion that I'm saving money in the long run by owning a motorcycle along with a car. Saving gas is nice, but the other expenses stack up quickly. There is having another insurance payment, another yearly tax and license payment, another vehicle depreciating in your garage, another vehicle to maintain, and having more capital tied up in a depreciating asset instead of an appreciating asset or savings account. It's not just the tires that gets you in the long run. These factors destroy any cost savings argument over just owning a single highly fuel efficient car.

These are the same problems that exists for owning a slow-speed electric NEV along with keeping a normal gas car for long trips. Buying more vehicles in order to save money on gas rarely pays off in the long run.

And I'm under no delusion that my motorcycle pollutes less than driving my car -- even though my car gets about half the mpg. Motorcycle engines just don't have the emissions controls and standards that cars have. And I have a quiet bike compared to many others, but I'm still putting out more noise pollution than most of the cars on the road. It consumes less gas, but that is the end of my motorcycle's green credentials. Unless you count riding wheelies as green because you aren't wearing the front tire while it is in the air...

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Wow, great thread guys. It's nice to see an actual discussion of real world experiences without the name calling, figures pulled out of * and other such bs that usually fills many of these threads. Good stuff.

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I get 60 mpg on my 2005 Honda 750 at $ 4.00 gal. gas I save $ 128.00 a month riding my bike. I also do the periodic maintenance myself what I can not do myself I take to a friend of mine who has a small shop a few miles up the road from the town I live in. He has worked on my bikes for the last 28 years and he is also certified to work on all brands and does not charge me an arm and leg to do it. I would not let the local bike shops around here work on my wheel-barrow much less my bike. for some it may cost a little more to ride but not for me. Plus the enjoyment I get from riding is priceless.

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Yes, tires can really be that expensive if you pay MSRP at the dealer and get them professionally mounted with the wheels on the bike. An SV650 is a good practical commuter, but it uses sportbike tires that last maybe 7k for the rear and 10k for the front. The rear tire is something like $190 MSRP plus tax, waste disposal, and maybe $50+ labor. Mail order tires are much cheaper (maybe 30-40% off), but good luck finding a shop to mount them as BrianM said. The way to save money is to take the wheels off yourself. Mounting and balancing with the wheels off the bike is usually $10-15 if you bought the tire there or $20-25 if not.

Valve lash adjustments can kill you on cost too, but it's no big deal if you shop carefully. Hondas and Suzukis with shim under bucket valves go 15k miles between adjustments. Yamahas go 26k mi. Other engines with shim over bucket valves need service as often as 6-10k mi.

You won't save a whole lot of money commuting on a motorcycle even with $4 gas, but you will save time with the carpool lanes, you'll have easier parking, and you might have more fun than being stuck in a cage.

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"The actual fact of the matter motorcycles need more frequent fill-ups becuase they generally only hold 2-4 gallons of gasoline, and therefore do not have the range of a car."

My motorcycle gets 45mpg (older VFR) and holds 5.3 gal. Thats almost 240 miles between fillups. My durango that I drive, holds 25 Gal and averages 15 to 17 highway. Roughly 400 miles out of a tank. I only fill it every half a tank. So about every 200 miles I fill it up. Now, thats about as much as I'd fill up my motorcycle. I don't think thats "more often" especially since gas is more expensive, and people aren't filling their tanks as much anymore, because the extra weight of gas isn't worth carrying around and decreasing fuel economy.

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It really does depend on your driving situation and what you plan on doing with your transportation. In my case I only need a private vehicle every once in a while, and therefore, when given the option between a $2000 bike or a $6000 car, I chose the bike. My most common mode of transportation is the bus, because I live in the city. And being that I live in Pittsburgh, I can only ride the bike about 7 months of the year, and that's pushing it. All in all, with the small amount that I actually drive, and the fact that most of the miles driven are highway miles (going to visit family), I think the bike is the less costly option. Of course, that's just my personal situation.

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