Ener1 first to integrate lithium-ion battery into HEV (explains the difference between HEV and PHEV batteries to me)
Filed under: EV/Plug-in, Hybrid, Toyota, EVS23
In October, we noticed a Prius in an Ener1 video and predicted Ener1 was working on a plug-in Prius. Later, we read in SEC files that Ener1 would show a demonstration car in December and questioned if the Prius was that car. Turns out we were right, almost. That car in the video did use Ener1's batteries but it was not a plug-in and there is a difference.Ener1 released a press release today that said they were the first to integrate a lithium-ion battery into a HEV (hybrid electric vehicle). The first? What about all those PHEVs (plug-in hybrid electric vehicles)? Aren't they just HEVs with a plug? I contacted Ener1 and they schooled me on the differences. Jerry Herlihy, Ener1's Chief Financial Officer, explained:
The battery for HEV is very different than PHEV. It requires power rather than energy density; it requires a large number of cycles; it needs to be safe; it requires a high C rate (time to charge and discharge); it needs to cold crank; it needs to operate in low temperatures, etc. And it has to be affordable.
And Ener1 will be affordable. According to the press release, a video tape of the test drive of the Prius will be made available to the press and the video will be at the Ener1 website soon. Third party testing of the batteries' performance in the Prius will be released the first quarter of 2008. The Ener1 battery gives twice as much power to the Prius electric motor and the increase in performance is expected to be substantial. Ener1 will also give a presentation to registered participants at EVS-23 today. AutoblogGreen's Sebastian is at EVW23, so stay tuned for reports directly from the show floor.
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- Everything you ever wanted to know about Ener1's batteries
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Reader Comments (Page 1 of 1)
12-04-2007 @ 2:13PM
why not the LS2LS7? said...
Hmm. "C rate" is a bit confusing. "C" is the capacity of the battery. If a battery has a power delivery rate (the power density talked about) of 1C, then it can be safely discharged at a rate which will discharge it in an hour. 1C is a pretty normal max discharge rate for a LIon battery, while NiMNs can go to perhaps 10C and a NiCD perhaps to 30C!
A battery with a higher power density will be able to be safely discharged more rapidly. That means the battery doesn't last as long, but it means you get better performance. Since discharge rates are usually peaky, being able to go to 3C for small bursts is great, and doesn't mean you'll kill your battery in 20 mins in normal use (you will in worst case though).
Most Lions also can only be charged at 1C, which (due to how constant current voltage limited charging works) means they can be charged up from to 0% to about 80% in an hour and filled all the way up in 3 hours. If you can charge faster than 1C, you can reduce that first hour, although the voltage limit means putting in the last 20% will still be pretty slow.
So, to correct the article text a bit, a "high C rate" doesn't mean a big C number, it means a high max rate of discharge expressed in C (kind of like CD-ROM drives 'X' numbers), and it means a LOW time to discharge, not a high time to discharge.
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12-04-2007 @ 2:25PM
Lascelles Linton said...
why not the LS2/LS7?, It's a direct quote and probably only meant to show roughly explain the difference. It may not be perfect but he was kind enough to educate me on the difference so I won't correct it. I am not even sure how to verify it anyway. Thanks for the clarification anyway.
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12-04-2007 @ 2:32PM
AES said...
When I talked to the EnerDel folks at EVS, they indicated that their pack completely replaces the existing NiMH pack in the Prius, instead of supplementing it like a Hymotion PHEV pack.
The main advantage seems to be 1) cost, and 2) the EnerDel pack can tolerate a wider range of states of charge. In other words, due to the flatter discharge curve of lithium (no loss of power as you drain the battery), the battery can provide power assist at 90%SOC down to about 10%SOC. And thus there's more USABLE energy held in the pack as well.
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12-04-2007 @ 2:48PM
werepants said...
Sounds like an ultracapacitor. Almost infinite charge cycling, good performance in extreme temperatures, super fast charging and discharging...
The biggest downsides are low energy density and high cost. If you factor in the high reliability and performance, it seems like a no-brainer to me.
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12-04-2007 @ 3:14PM
jcwinnie said...
Since we are correcting LL on details, I would take issue with the adjective "first" since Mr. Linton informed us not too long ago about lithium ion batteries in a Vitz. And, Subaru and Toyota have been testing lithium manganese batteries for some time.
http://jcwinnie.biz/wordpress/?p=2597
First time for EnerDel, perhaps?
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12-04-2007 @ 4:04PM
Lascelles Linton said...
Jcwinnie, Technically that was not a hybrid. I thought it might be but it seems the battery there does not drive the wheels in anyway. It replaces almost everything else that's electrical. You might recall I wrote about a system that would completely replace the alternator and that's basically what that does. I am really shocked we don't see much more of this, the savings are tremendous.
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12-05-2007 @ 12:48AM
philmcneal said...
interesting... a fuel efficency upgrade for 1500 or a plug for more than 9000, some tough choices in the future, but choices is good when you own a prius!
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12-05-2007 @ 2:51AM
Chris M said...
Sounds like they are trying to get a contract to supply batteries to Toyota. Seems unlikely, as Toyota has a share in the Panasonic EV Energy division.
They should also look to sell to Ford, Honda, and several other auto makers.
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12-06-2007 @ 10:32AM
jerry herlihy said...
Technically, why not the LS2/LS7? is correct, but most interested persons and investors would not understand. So I intend to say "improved C rate" in the future. Thanks for your post.
Also, Lascelles is correct; the Vitz is not a hybrid. It runs the AC and electrical systems when the engine is stopped, but does not have enough power to move a car. Toyota makes a handful of Vitz's each month.
You may want to read our media release on safety from this summer and what we say about graphite anodes.
Jerry Herlihy
Ener1 CFO
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12-06-2007 @ 10:57AM
Lascelles Linton said...
Jerry Herlihy, Thanks for commenting. You noticed we have some very sharp readers :D If you want to make any changes to the quote, I could make them.
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12-06-2007 @ 11:45AM
Tim said...
WOW! It's a real honor to have the Ener1 CFO read and comment on this blog.
Welcome aboard Mr. Herlihy. We expect great things from EnerDel!
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