Filed under: EV/Plug-in, GM, Toyota, Tesla Motors
Complete video of CBS Sunday Morning's report on electric cars
As promised, here is the link to the complete video of the CBS Sunday Morning feature story on electric cars. David Pogue did a great job of summing up the current state of electric cars. David starts out by talking with the author of the book Zoom, Vijay Vaitheeswaran, about how ethanol and hydrogen take too much energy. David drives a Prius, then test drives the Tesla electric roadster and talks to Tesla's co-founder Martin Eberhard. David then talks to Bob Lutz of GM and admits to sending Bob e-mails saying he will "rot in hell" for crushing the EV1. David then takes a look at batteries at GM's labs and interviews Chris Paine, director of Who Killed the Electric Car. News tidbit: Chris is making a second movie called "Who Saved the Electric Car?"
[Source: CBS]
Reader Comments (Page 1 of 1)
Tim 10:38AM (9/17/2007)
I think CBS did a good job. I really liked the part where GM's battery partners told Bob Lutz to stop saying "If" when referring to the batteries.
I do wish that they should have gone one step further and mentioned renewable electricity including home rooftop PV electricity. Bob should have elaborated more on the gas mileage at different ranges like 0-40 miles = no gas, 0-60 = x mpg, 0-100 = x mpg, 0-150 = x mpg, when going the full 650 mile range between charges the volt gets over 50 mpg when they mentioned the fact that 82% of all commutes are less than 40 miles, but the Volt has a range of 650 miles.
There has to be a way for Mr. Lutz to memorize a little 5 second sound bite on these mileage facts and then repeat them at every opportunity.
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Gregory La Vardera 10:48AM (9/17/2007)
Well done David Pogue. He has the knack for getting the crux of the story across with real info, while still making it fun. I loved when he apologized to Bob Lutz for the "rot in hell" email.
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GoodCheer 11:54AM (9/17/2007)
Tim said: "Bob should have elaborated more on the gas mileage at different ranges like 0-40 miles = no gas, 0-60 = x mpg, 0-100 = x mpg, 0-150 = x mpg, when going the full 650 mile range."
I agree that would be interesting stuff to know, but since the battery pack doesn't exist yet, and the ICE has not been fully specked yet (as far as I know), and probably the two electric motors and their respective controllers have not been selected / designed yet, that information does not exist. In addition, anything Lutz said might be subject to whatever legal sway the EPA mileage estimates have with respect to advertisements.
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mattyp 12:21PM (9/17/2007)
when it says it took silicon valley workers to be able to create an electric car people would drive its not exactly true.
In france Venturi made an electric sports car in 2004 called the fetish which was great. it didnt look as good (a bit ugly) but it was esentially the same thing. 5th gear (uk tv car show)test drove it a few years back and it was silent and fast and handled like a lotus elise.
maybe because it was french america didnt want to know.
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Tony Belding 12:49PM (9/17/2007)
Note: online video only for those with *high* speed internet. My mere Wi-Fi connection can't keep up with it. Fortunately I caught the video on my DVR.
I agree with Gregory. Pogue has a way of putting a humorous twist on things while still getting his facts straight. The Tesla looked fantastic, too.
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Tony Belding 12:51PM (9/17/2007)
Mattyp. . . The Venturi Fetish is cool, but I think the reason people "didn't want to know" is because those cars cost $500,000+, and Venturi said they are only going to make 25 total, worldwide. It's also unclear whether any have yet been delivered to actual customers.
Personally, I think the Fetish looks fantastic, perhaps even better than the Tesla Roadster. However, the Fetish has an awkward hump running through the cabin, between the seats -- that's where the battery is housed. It has a fixed gear ratio and somewhat lower performance specs than the Roadster, and it costs several times as much. The Fetish is much easier to dismiss as an anomaly or as a mere novelty item for the super-rich.
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KC 1:46PM (9/17/2007)
The battery still remains the big question and the biggest problem.
If GM leases the battery the Volt is going to be a still born baby.
If GM sells the battery to the customer outright without subsidies, the Volt is going to cost as much or more then a Tesla roadster. A hard sell with a Bow tie on the the grille.
If GM subsidizes the batteries they have to bank on the notion that every person who's ever blogged about the volt, commented on the blogs about the volt, and all of their entire families are ready to put up the cash to buy one. They'd need to get the number of units sold up to a very big number very fast to get production costs down on the battery to a point where GM can be profitable on the car within it's models life span (~5 years).
We'll see what happens in two years but I'm not ready to bet the farm that E-Flex is going to change the game just yet.
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AES 2:30PM (9/17/2007)
"If GM sells the battery to the customer outright without subsidies, the Volt is going to cost as much or more then a Tesla roadster."
Umm...no. Even if GM bought A123's cells at the outrageous price that RC hobbyists currently get gouged for ($20 a pop), the car would still cost less than 60 grand.
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jcwinnie 2:42PM (9/17/2007)
Mock-ups are cool, when you really want to build something. Unfortunately, Maximum Bob would seem to be living there. The contrast between David Pogue riding in a Tesla versus listening to the latest Lutz pitch was telling. I think Vijay Vaitheeswaran has GM's number.
"We were doing the right thing legally, said Lutz, referring to crushing the EV1, and I wanted to stop the taping an get a clarification. When you say doing the right thing legally, Bobbo, is that the same as resisting with legal action when, in the absence of federal action, states attempt to act against the contribution to climate change by automobiles. How come that isn't a PR nightmare, too?
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Chris M 5:26PM (9/17/2007)
Loved the show, even though I only saw it on a small screen on my computer.
What GM did to the EV1 was legal, but not "right". That's why the crushing of those great cars was a self-inflicted PR nightmare for GM.
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why not the LS2LS7? 6:17PM (9/17/2007)
I can't wait to see "Who saved the Eletric Car?". I'd love to see Chris weasel out of absolving the battery technology as (partially) to blame for the demise of the electric car.
When full-fledge electric cars like the Tesla Roadster are looking at installing $40K+ worth of batteries in a car, that despite its tiny size still only goes 200 miles on a charge, it's tough to say the battery technology is really up to speed.
The consumer needs to take more of the blame, as they showed themselves by and large unwilling (at the time) to pay more to get less functionality in an electric car.
And finally, the electric grid itself needs to take some of the blame. With the near impossibility of most renters or condo owners of getting a 220V outlet in their garage (and the $1K bill for even homeowners to do it). And beyond that with the fact that if everyone on your block had an electric car and charged their car at full rate at night, you'd significantly overload your local distribution transformers.
To Chris M and others above, I ask: do you seriously think $100,000 two seaters are really going to save the world? What Tesla has shown so far is not the answer, any more than the AC Propulsion T Zero was.
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mattypape 6:24PM (9/17/2007)
lol, i stand corrected, i didnt know it cost that much, thanks
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Tony Belding 6:50PM (9/17/2007)
Did anybody seriously suggest that the Tesla Roadster is going to save the world? No. Nobody said that. It's a harbinger of things to come.
The batteries in the Tesla Roadster are probably closer to $20,000 rather than $40,000+. I expect to see large decreases in battery prices after new production facilities are built. It's not far-fetched to imagine their cost dropping by as much as 90% when production catches up with demand. That's what happened to LCD monitors, for example, which are fiendishly difficult items to manufacture.
Furthermore, Tesla are paying about twice what GM or Toyota would pay for every component that goes into the car, due to their low production volume. That'll change.
There's nothing inherently more expensive to manufacture in an electric car than there is in a gasoline-powered car. If you look at what goes into a gasoline engine, it's mind-boggling that they can be made and sold as cheaply as they are. It's possible because the industry has learned for decades how to produce them efficiently in huge numbers. The same thing will happen with electric cars, and that batteries will be cost-reduced, it'll just take a while. But, the process has to start somewhere. It's starting with the Tesla Roadster and the Chevy Volt.
What I find remarkable is that the Tesla Roadster can compete head-to-head in its chosen market niche, as an exotic sports car, against gasoline-powered cars that cost much more. It should be able to hold its own against some $400,000 sports cars out there. It's been a long, long time since we've seen any electric car that could hold its own against any gas car in any role whatosever. That's why it grabs so much attention; that's why it's seen as a watershed.
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grimmex 7:32PM (9/17/2007)
I dunno about you guys, but I can get a 200 mile electric car at http://www.lionev.com/Vehicles.html for a lot less than $98,000.
You can even buy the batteries alone and build your own car if you like.
(And no, I have no affiliation with Lion EV)
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Chris M 9:33PM (9/17/2007)
A few corrections: The Venturi Fetish was $350,000 not $500,000. Still really expensive. Tesla hasn't revealed the price of their battery pack, but estimates based on wholesale LiIon battery prices plus thermal control and safety electronics would indicate a price around $20,000 to $22,000.
To answer " why not the LS2/LS7" - I don't expect the Tesla Roadster or any other electric car to "save the world". I only expect them to help solve a few problems that now exist.
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Phil L. 9:53PM (9/17/2007)
grimmex -
Can this vehicle actually be purchased? A web page does make an actual sale.
Is anyone aware of any vehicles from Lion EV that are in the hands of actual end consumers?
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