AutoblogGreen

Sam, you left our a field: crush-able: yes yes

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Only a moron would drive around a Suburban or Tahoe
to go buy groceries. First your destroying the environment, second your burning a huge amount of money that could be used for many worthy causes. Lastly parking and driving around in such a huge vehicle is a major pain in the ass. Try parking it
before you throw down your dollars for a monument to
greed and materialism.

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Yes for grocies Doug. But have you ever tried going to home depot in a little compact, and then loading it up? I agree most people don't need SUV/Trucks but when you do have one and every week someone asks you if they can borrow your truck for XYZ then you will understand they have their place and usefullness. Now if we could incorporate this great VOLT technology on a Chevy Silverado, then we are talking!

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Hey guys, GM is doing a little survey where they ask whether a) they should build this car and b) whether you would consider buying such a car. If you want GM to build this car then go and vote. Here is the link that can be also found directly on GM's website:
http://www.gm.com/company/gm_exp_live/events/naias_2007/index_flash.html?navID=3.0.1.1&seo=goo_volt
and then "vote for volt"

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Now put in a one liter tubro diesel range extender to run on biodiesel and you'll sell a millon of them.

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Doug, relax...if someone wants to drive a Suburban/Tahoe/Yukon etc., then that is their preference. I haven't been to enthused about vehicles like this until I read about the Volt concept. Sounds like a great idea, and certainly user-friendly.

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Based on the side-by-side numbers above, GM's obviously worked out the specs they want the Volt to meet, including the to-be-developed Li Ion batteries that are the key to making this viable. However, looking at NREL's testing data (http://www.nrel.gov/vehiclesandfuels/energystorage/pdfs/40378.pdf, p. 17 of presentation) on existing Li Ion batteries, it looks like there are at least a few already out there manufactured by Saft (http://www.saftbatteries.com/120-Techno/20-10_produit.asp?paramtechnolien=20-10_lithium_system.asp¶mtechno=Lithium+systems&Intitule_Produit=VLMcells) that will meet the power/energy ratio needed. I know there are a lot of other factors to work out (thermal management, calendar and charge life, energy density, cost, safety). So is that more the sticking point? In other words, are we looking at more of an evolution in Li Ion battery design than some revolutionary design breakthrough?

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Thanks, Sam. Yeah, I saw that announcement. So do you think maybe the contractual award to the JCS and Cobasys-A123 joint ventures to develop a battery for the Vue - is a kind of "cover" to obtain the critical missing link that allows the VOlt (and possibly other platforms) to go to full production?

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Why didn't you compare it to the second generation EV1? it has much better specs!

EV1 (Gen 2)
Battery type: NiMh
Battery volume: 250L
Charging voltage: 220V
Charging Time: 6-8 hours
QuickCharge Capable NO
Passenger capacity: 2 passengers
Acceleration (0-60) below 8 sec
Top speed: 80 mph
Pure EV Range: 75-150 miles
Total Range 75-150 miles
Curb weight: 3084 lbs

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I'm excited about the Chevy Volt except for the 40 mile range. If the EV1 with a lead acid battery had a range of 60-90 miles and the second generation with the NiMh battery had a 75-150 miles range,
it seems to me that the LiIon battery should have a longer range.
Is GM still protecting the interest of the oil cartel?

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I totally agree with your comment there Robert -- isn't anyone else out there shaking their heads?! It's been 10 years, and it's obvious from the specs that this new Volt is inferior to the EV-1. Anyone else see the documentary "Who Killed the Electric Car"?

So this is to prove that in 10 years, GM 1) makes an inferior electric vehicle using newer technology, and 2) is relying on us consumers to forget everything before the turn of the millenium. Sorry GM, but I've got a healthy brain and can clearly see you've done absolutely crap with your R&D department / funds. Well, worse than crap since you're building a crappier car than you did 10 years ago.

And when the hell are the japanese going to make some real ALL electric cars en masse? Someone really needs to off all those oil company big wigs.

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Chuong- There have been many surveys which confirm that 78% of drivers commute less than 40 miles each day and return home to recharge each night.

The 40 mile E-Flex range was chosen so that 78% of driving could be all electric while keeping the battery size, weight and COST to a minimum.

A 40 mile all electric range with a range extender generator is balancing in the sweet spot. I’m sure that there will be an option to purchase more batteries to replace the range extender with for those who want it.

First they need LOTS of field testing on the new batteries to be absolutely certain that they will last a minimum of 10 years and will be completely safe. If only ONE family burns up in a battery fire the following litigation could kill the electric cars for years to come. Big Oil would love that!

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Robert...

A couple of major facts to remember:

- Chevy Volt is a 4-5 passenger vehicle versus 2. That's a significant difference.

- Chevy Volt incorporates a lot of features that today are standard but weren't nearly 10 yrs ago. (More air bags, advanced traction control, more luxury devices, likely GPS nav, etc.) All of that is extra weight, extra electric use, etc.

- Chevy Volt is designed to be able to go 120mph. In truth, there are many places around the world where people regularly drive over 80mph. (Connecticut is just one example. *lol*) But essentially what this means is that there is more motor in the Volt than the EV1.

- Evaluate the weight involved. Realize that the Chevy Volt weighs more with half the battery volume and MUCH lighter batteries. (LiIon batteries are way lighter than old Lead Acid or NiMH). My guess is there is a lot more car there in the Volt. I never got to drive an EV1. But it always looked rather light on the build. Kind of like an old Hyundai or Kia. That's fine for many who just want an environmental friendly car. But many consumers won't buy a car if the build quality is low. The Volt is being designed to be a mass-appeal vehicle, as such a little bit more is going to into the body than the EV1.

- Chevy Volt, styling is also a factor. EV1 was designed mainly for aerodynamics with less emphasis on aesthetic appeal. The Chevy Volt is being designed so that someone who usually would go for a Mustang might even find it appealing.

These compromises may reduce efficiency but they will likely increase marketibility. What does that mean? A better chance of commercial success. And if they can get the Chevy Volt production ramped up to marketable levels then they can later release a budget conscience more efficient "Prius/Insight" style model that will have less aesthetic and auto appeal but even higher energy efficiency.

They'll be able to do that because the technology involved at that point will be being produced in large enough quantities.

Everyone is demonizing GM as killing the electric car. In truth, that is a very false accusation. The Chevy Volt shows that GM "learned from the electric car".

- Saj

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While I think the Volt is a great step in the right direction, I'm almost convinced we could do one better and just convert all existing vehicles to electric with the Lithium batteries,300 mile plus range etc. It'd be the most practical solution. If charging stations were made as readily available as gas stations are, we could end our foriegn oil dependance entirely. If it weren't for big oil government we could live in a cleaner, peaceful electric world, with zero ties to the Arab oil world.

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Don't wait for battery improvements, 20-40 mile range is enough for many people. The range extender is great. If I need to go further or carry a load I will take my truck. With an electric car 95% of my driving would be gas free.

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"If charging stations were made as readily available as gas stations are, we could end our foreign oil dependance entirely."

Although it would be nice to do that, we use oil for a lot of other things besides gasoline. Think about any plastic things you use in your life such as ipods, food containers, pens, etc, and you will see that oil plays a big part in all of our lives.

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GM had best be building this and quick, with the advent of fuel prices rising to the 4 dollar a gallon range soon. They need to build something like the German-made Loremo which weighs in the thousand pound range and will get around 150 MPG with a 1.0 liter turbo diesel. Then GM could truly compete in a global market. It seems as if they like to keep all such products away from American consumers, but they're all over Europe!

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I personally would much rather have the EV1 than the Volt. I like the styling of the EV1. The Volt looks like a muscle car. The first buyers of this type of vehicle will be the average mom and dad not the muscle car guy.

The EV1, had it not been scrapped could have been up to a 150-200 mile range on a single charge with quick charging as an option.

I would much rather have an EV1 for my daily commute than wasting energy on the gas engine in the Volt. GM is going to shoot themselves in the foot AGAIN!

Tesla motors already gets an average range of 125-150 miles on their all electric car. It looks better, performs better and is being sold now. They even have the 1000 cars for 2008 already sold.

GM should just take out the plans for the EV1 version 2 with the NiMh batteries and build the damn thing. It WILL sell.

As for speed, you foget that a modified EV1 set the land speed record for electric vehicles at 183 MPH. The EV1 was artifically limited to 80 MPH. The regular production model had a top speed of over 150 MPH without the artifical limit.

Had their been no limiter the average cop probably would not be able to catch an EV1.

Also remember the EV1 had the lowest coefficient of drag of ANY consumer vehicle EVER MADE including today. The car was entirely silent below 30 MPH except for a small whine from gearing connected to the motor.

I would much prefer to have a near silent car that one with an engine running.

The EV1 is needed NOW much more than the Volt is. The Volt is a dead concept already. Tesla Motors is already way ahead on technology and has already hinted that other companies are licensing their drive train. Nissan has announced all electric cars within 5 years that have at least 150 mile range.

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